I’ve been fortunate to have two quick visits by my kids. They called my husband and asked what he wanted for Father’s Day. He said he wanted to see them.
My daughter’s visit was fun because she had a few days off and we got to spend a lot of time together. It’s been great to have my son here, too, but he works remotely so we only had evenings free to talk and hang out.
Both kids wanted my home cooking rather than going out. That made me smile. It made me mom proud.
I enjoyed watching my son work remotely. He wears a headset and stands while working on his computer. He’s either typing away furiously or conducting meetings, laughing, talking and smiling. He works nonstop from 8 a,m. until the evening when he finishes up with his last meeting.
I’m very proud of the adult he’s become and how hard working he is. Also, it seems this is a job he really enjoys.
Now that they’re gone I’m a bit sad, but happy that they are living their lives.
My husband asked me to sit and watch a webinar with him yesterday. It was CE credits for him, but he thought I’d find the subject interesting. Begrudgingly, I sat with him. Surprisingly, there were a few tidbits that I found helpful.
The topic was about what makes people happy in retirement. Number one was not being stressed about money. At a certain point, when you aren’t worrying about outliving your money, more money doesn’t improve happiness. Good health is another key item.
I was surprised that friendships were near the top of the list. When people leave the workplace, they often give up their daily social interactions. I thought about this because it’s something I’m dealing with now. Since the pandemic and moving to Arizona, I don’t have the day-to-day interactions with people that I had before. Of course, I lived in California for three decades in the same house, so I had it wired. I had the swim team, women’s club, my kids’ school parents, etc. I stayed in touch with people I worked with years before and we still got together. I knew the postman, the grocery clerk and countless other people.
Moving to a new state and neighborhood, we were lucky to discover friends from Palm Springs who moved a mile away from our new home. It’s refreshing to get a last minute call and be invited over for football or dinner. And we reciprocate.
My husband had one of his closest friends two miles down the road. They were friends from their 20s and we got together every week or two since we moved. But my husband’s friend died suddenly in November from an illnesses that was not COVID. Watching the webinar, my husband muttered a few words about missing his friend.
I haven’t thought much about needing friends or a social life. I’m pretty content to sit at home and watch the birds. Sit outside and read. I didn’t really view myself as a people person. This webinar made me think about the years ahead.
It’s hard to make new friends when you’re older, not in a work environment and in a new state. The webinar convinced me to join book club, which I’ve never done before. I had gotten an invitation earlier that day. It was a sign that yes, I’d better give it a try.
Here is what I found really fascinating about the webinar: most people facing retirement think living close to their children will make them happy. In reality it doesn’t bump the needle like friendships do. It’s not even close.
What do you think will make you happy in retirement? Why do you think living close to your children doesn’t make retirees as happy as social friends?
A little over a year ago, I wrote this post. It was during the lockdown and I was in high amped worry mode. I was extremely anxious about my daughter who was laid off and was frustrated because her unemployment was on hold — along with 1.5 million other Californians who were lost in the system. She wrote to her assemblywomen, senators, governor, etc. but nobody helped. She’d call everyday to the EDD and nobody answered the phone. They had an 8 a.m. to noon window where they would accept calls. The one time she got through, the person said they were hired to answer the phone but couldn’t access the system. To this day she is still owed thousands of dollars from 2020. I’m going off track, but here’s what I wrote in October 2020:
I read a fascinating story that said “Study Confirms That Parents Still Lose Sleep Worrying About Their Adult Children.” I am definitely on of those parents who loses sleep and I know my dear friend Gabby, who shared this story on Facebook is one, also.
Even before our children are born, we worry about them. We’re relieved when we count the 10 fingers and 10 toes in the hospital, but we still worry. We’re relieved when they do well on their tests in school and make the team, but we still worry. We worry about safety, about their grades, about what they’ll do for a career, about who they’ll one day marry or if they’ll get married at all. The list of things to worry about feels endless.
We hope that our worries will ease as our children get older, but it turns out that’s not the case.
A photo from our beach vacation two years ago.
Can you relate to this as a parent, too? On my current list of worries is the bad air quality from California fires, my kids driving through the Cyclone Bomb weather, which is a rare event with high winds, rain and even snow, plus their general safety living in the Bay Area. I worry that they are secure in their careers and find their work satisfying and are able to make a living.
Here’s more from the story about parents who worry about adult kids:
A recent study conducted by Amber J. Seidel of Pennsylvania State University confirms what many parents already know – you never stop worrying about your children. Her study went on to show that parents actually lose sleep worrying about their adult children.
Parents, it looks like we’ll be worrying forever. If your children are already adults, you may already know that to be true.
In Seidel’s study, 186 heterosexual married couples with adult children were surveyed. On a scale of 1 to 8, they were asked how much assistance they offer their children. Assistance could include financial, emotional or even chatting on the phone. Choosing 1 meant daily assistance and interaction where 8 was only once a year.
The parents were also asked to choose from 1 to 5 regarding stress. In this case, choosing 1 meant no stress, and 5 meant the maximum amount of stress.
The third thing these parents tracked was how much sleep they got at night. Moms got an average of 6.66 hours and dads got slightly more with an average of 6.69 hours.
The results were not the same for moms and dads. For moms, it didn’t matter if they were the ones offering assistance or if their husbands were the ones offering assistance; moms were stressed out and sleeping less either way.
Dads showed a lack of sleep and more stress only when they were the ones offering assistance to their adult children. If their wife offered assistance, it didn’t affect them. This either means that dads are not affected in the same way as moms or that the wives weren’t telling their husbands about the assistance causing the dads to be stress free due to lack of knowledge about the situation.
I found it interesting that the dads didn’t lose sleep if their wives were the ones offering support. Or, like the article said, maybe they weren’t aware of what was going on. But the moms lost sleep regardless who was the main person offering support to their kids.
Do you worry about your children too, regardless of their age? What do you worry about most?
My kids are on their way to adulting. One will be celebrating a full-year on the job in a month, post-college degree. My daughter is going to career fairs and has interviewed for two jobs so far, landing one job offer. I will repeat and say loudly that I had nothing to do with it. Well, maybe one thing—I helped them by purchasing clothes for their interviews. But that was it. Apparently, other parents of millennials are getting much more involved. I wrote about crazy helicopter parents interfering in their children’s job searches a few months ago here.
I discovered another article that gives more examples of parents going over the line in the name of “helping” their children. The article is called “Parents of millennials are too involved in their kids’ careers” by Corinne Purtill on Quartz. She talks about a mom “mean tweeting” a company that didn’t offer her son a job and includes scary statistics from a 2016 survey of how many helicopter parents are getting involved in their adult children’s careers. You can read an excerpt here:
“Parents: butt out of your adult children’s job searches.
“This may seem obvious. But it’s not, in the context of the wildly inappropriate parental intrusions that hiring managers see with astounding regularity. Parents are calling to arrange interviews for perfectly functional adult children, inserting themselves into schedule or salary negotiations, and haranguing a manager by phone or email for failing to hire or promote their precious offspring.
“In a misguided effort to help their children gain short-term achievement, hiring managers say, many parents unwittingly cripple their adult sons’ and daughters’ ability to succeed on their own. What’s more, these unhealthy entanglements in their adult child’s professional life are preventing parents from being supportive in ways that actually do help their child—who is, in fact, an adult.
“Much too much
“In a 2016 survey of helicopter parenting in the workplace from the staffing firm OfficeTeam, senior managers reported parental intrusions of astonishing cheek: asking to sit in on job interviews, bringing cakes to potential employers, calling the hiring manager in the guise of an employment reference to heap praise on their son.
“After media reports of meddling parents in the workplace started surfacing after the recession of the early 2000s, Michigan State University researcher Phil Gardner surveyed 725 employers about whether they’d seen such behavior. A full 31% of respondents had a parent apply for a job on behalf of their adult child, according to a 2007 report. Another 15% of the employers fielded complaints from parents about passed-over children, 9% had a parent try to negotiate the new hire’s salary or benefits, and 4% actually attended job interviews alongside their adult children. The financial crisis of 2008 and the rise of texting, which enabled constant communication between parents and grown kids, has only intensified the trend.
“On this point hiring managers are explicitly clear: absolutely nothing good comes of a parent getting involved in a child’s job search.
“No employer is going to think this is okay,” said Alison Green, a consultant who writes the popular blog Ask a Manager. “Managers really need to refuse to engage if a parent contacts them, assuming it’s not to relay some sort of serious emergency with their kid.”
“Casey Newton, an editor at the Verge, received a baffling direct message on Twitter in 2016. The tone of the message was accusatory. It was “something along the lines of, ‘You have a lot of nerve getting someone’s hopes up like that,’” Newton recalled. He’d never met the woman, but her last name looked familiar. A quick check of her social media profiles confirmed she was the mother of a job candidate Newton had recently passed over.”
It is stunning to me that 31% of parents interviewed in the study quoted in the article, applied to jobs on behalf of their adult children. I bet they are the same parents who did their children’s homework to ensure good grades. Then, they filled out college applications and wrote the college entrance essays, too.
My kids on their way to adulting.
What are these parents thinking? Do you have any idea of why parents would do this to adult kids?
I read a series of articles today about how we are threatening our own retirement by “helping” our kids with their expenses. I was reminded of a conversation I had with my best friend from college. She told me that she was cutting off the money flow with her grown kids and although it was painful, she said, “the less you help them, the better off they are.”
On a website called Benefits Pro, an article called “How to keep grown kids from ruining your future retirement” by Marlene Y. Satter caught my attention.
“A BMO Wealth Institute survey, the report says, found that two-thirds of parents give money to their grown kids on a “when needed” basis, checkbook out in hand almost before they’re asked.
“But if instead you budget—and make Junior budget—for a specific amount at regular intervals, with a firm end date to such support, he’ll learn to budget better and you’ll have a light at the end of the tunnel so that you can get back to saving for retirement.
“Or, for that matter, enjoying retirement without that constant drain looming over your activities.
“Last but not least, you need to lay your cards on the table about the end of the financial support so that the kids know just how much all that parental help is costing you.
“They won’t be blindsided, you won’t feel resentful about the endless outflow of money if they’re working toward resolving their own situation—whether finding a job, finishing a degree or finding cheaper living quarters—and you’ll both be better off for knowing each others’ true financial states.
“After all, the Merrill Lynch research points out, 28 percent of parents are worried that they themselves might have to ask their kids for financial help some day.
“One way to avoid that—or at least postpone it—is to make sure that your kids learn financial independence by example.
In a Market Watch article called “This is how much money parents lose supporting their adult children” by Kari Paul, she talks about how we can lose a quarter million dollars of our retirement funds by supporting our kids after they become adults.
“Leaving the nest doesn’t always mean entering financial independence for kids these days, and parents are paying a high price for it.
“Some 80% of parents are covering or have covered basic expenses for their children after they turn 18, which could cost parents $227,000 in lost savings over the course of retirement, a new study from personal finance website NerdWallet found.
“It calculated the impact on savings if costs of adult children had been put into a retirement savings account such as a 401(k) or IRA instead.
“ ‘As parents, we tend to want to do everything we can to help our children succeed. But sometimes we focus on the present at the expense of the future,” said Andrea Coombes, NerdWallet’s investing expert.
“Student debt, which has surpassed $1.4 billion, has also played a role in increasing reliance of young people on parents. Some 28% of parents have paid for part or all of their adult children’s tuition or loans. The average parent now takes out $21,000 in loans for a college education for their child.
“They are also paying for many basic, day-to-day costs for their adult children, including groceries (56%), health insurance (40%) and rent or housing outside the family home (21%). Some parents are also covering or have covered their adult child’s cellphone bill (39%) and car insurance (34%).”
Business Insider writer Elena Holodny quotes the same numbers in “Baby boomers could end up $227,000 richer if they stop bankrolling their adult children:”
“The two most expensive costs are living expenses and college tuition. And parents’ retirement savings could be $227,000 higher if they chose to save that money instead of spending it on their children’ living or schooling expenses, NerdWallet found.
“Andrea Coombes, a retirement and investing specialist at NerdWallet, said parents should run the numbers to figure out whether they can actually afford to help their children with their expenses.
“ ‘Parents who need to ramp up their savings rate should have a conversation with their children,” Coombes said. “Parents can let their children know they’re at risk of financial insecurity later in life and they don’t want to be a burden to their children.
“And parents should ask their adult children to start pitching in on some of these expenses. It’ll be good for the parents’ retirement, plus it models to the children the importance of budgeting, saving, and planning for the future.”
With my oldest child turning 25 next year, this topic is close to home. He is mostly independent financially and has been out of college for a little more than a year. We are there when he needs help—like something major. Like many of the parents in the articles above, we have him on our cell phone plan and pay his car insurance. He lives in the Bay area and it’s really expensive to live there. We keep telling him he doesn’t have to live in the most expensive city in the country and he’s come to realize that fact on his own. I think this New Year will be an ideal time to have a talk about when we’ll wean him off the cell phone plan and car insurance. I know for a fact he can’t afford more immediately, but he could plan for it. Plus, he’s in the process of making decisions about whether or not he’s going to return to school or move to a more affordable area.
My husband gets upset with me when I give our son money. It makes me feel good to be able to do so, but in my husband’s words, “You’re crippling him!”
What are your thoughts about funding adult children after they graduate from college?
There once was a young boy with the biggest eyes and heart. He was all hugs, kisses, and could make me feel better by holding my hand. He called me “Sweetheart” because he thought that was my name. He was proud of his little sister and often made friends with this opening line: “Do you want to meet my little sister?”
My kids with Natasha our Rottie.
We went to visit this boy, who is now a grown man in San Francisco this past weekend. We were taking BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) for the first time by ourselves from SFO to Berkeley to see him on Friday night. A nice surprise was seeing our son waiting in the terminal to ride the train with us and to show us the ropes. That’s the kind of person he is—he thinks about others.
I know I did plenty wrong raising him and maybe helicoptered a bit too much. I argued with teachers about his grades. I protected him from failing by driving forgotten homework to school. I had no issue talking to a swim coach or principal if I thought he was being mistreated. In fact, he didn’t fail enough early on when the stakes weren’t so high. But he made up for it when it was costly and he was attending a UC. We must have done something right because he’s kind, considerate and stands on his own as an independent adult. He looks happy, healthy and he there’s no mistaking that big heart and his big blue eyes.
Three months old.
He carved out a chunk of time for us and spent the weekend showing us Golden Gate Park, walking for miles and miles, which is our favorite thing to do. He took us to the deYoung Museum where we discovered Oceanic Art, Art of the Early Americas and the Hamon Observation Tower with break taking 360’ views of San Francisco.
He shared his favorite restaurants and we dined in the Gourmet Ghetto at Lo Coco’s Restaurant for delicious Sicilian linguine with clams, LaNote, for a French bouillabaisse, and brunch at Venus. All amazing.
What’s even more amazing is that he rode back with us on BART to make sure we got on the right trains and could make the transfer. Then, he gave us a hug and returned to his life. He texted me later that day to say he loved seeing us and missed us so much!
I’m enjoying watching the adult person my son is becoming. I realize I may not have been a perfect parent, but I must have done plenty right. Plus, each of us is an individual in our own right, and no lack of parenting — or too much helicoptering — can change who we are.
How much impact do you think parenting has on our children and the adults they become?